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SS7
02-20-2009, 03:10 PM
So there you are trolling along and no bites....

What do you change first second etc?

How long do you wait before you change?

Lots of criteria comes to mind such as color, depth, scent, lure design, leader length what other options do you have?

Being a mechanic for 15+ yrs I relied alot on flow charts to help diagnose problems then built my own.

Does anyone have a set pattern?

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Lets get em in the boat.....

Bduck
02-20-2009, 03:39 PM
You will find alot of your answers here on this forum in the general section. There is some very knowledgeable fishermen there. Grab a cold one and enjoy. thumbsup

Kokonuts
02-20-2009, 03:49 PM
The way I see it :
1. Time of day / wheather 2. How deep 3. Colors 4. Type of lure/ dodger /attractor. After that it depends, I stick with the same set up for 30min. to 1 hour depending if I have fished the lake recently.

Of course I was wrong once but it happened so long ago I really cant remember what it was! laugh hyst laugh hyst

SuperD
02-20-2009, 03:50 PM
In general, it is lures and scents first and then location change.

Kokehead83
02-20-2009, 04:52 PM
First are you marking fish on the FF? Lets assume you are, then first i would change speed and depth. Make sure the bait is were the fish are then change up my speed. Now they still are not taking the bait. I swtich up my presentation and scent. This may mean dodger and hoochie, spine, bug etc. also consider size. I have been on a lake were hoochies would not catch fish but small tubes would so color sent size is something i always keep track of.

Ben

Fallriverguy
02-20-2009, 06:24 PM
My first action is to whine and moan about marking fish but not catching any. Then I start to talk to the fish and offer all kind of promises. If acting like a baby does not work, I'll see about changing lure color.

SilverBullets
02-20-2009, 10:50 PM
In my opinion, the right depth is the most important thing. If your marking fish but not getting a takedown, try adjusting your depth first. Also try more pronounced "s" turns (if your useing a short set-back). This will not only change your lures action, but also it's speed and depth. If you start getting hits on the inside of turns slow down, outside turns speed up a bit. I have found that color is very important, but don't overlook lure action also.
I have experienced fishing with the exact same set-ups on each side of the boat, same lure design, color, dodger, leader length, depth, scent, speed, the only difference was the action between the two lures. One was a hot spot apex, the other a pro-troll kok killer. They hammered the kok killer lure that day, wouldn't touch the apex...the only difference was the action between the two that they seemed to prefer that day. One mph slower or faster and it might have been the other way around.
There are definite colors they like through out the day, and always keep in mind as the day progresses you not only need to adjust your depth, but also your colors for that depth as you go down the water column. I take a few batches of corn, and always have one batch dyed pink. Some days they will prefer one over the other.
There are also days when your most consistent lure goes cold, so don't hesitate to try something totally different....don't keep dragging something around just because it worked the day before, sometimes koks like to play games with us! Oh, I almost forgot...adjust your set-back also if your not getting fish. There are times a short set-back works with ball trolls, but if that's not working try shedding the trolls, or get back farther in back of the boat. One more option you have that I haven't seen mentioned is change your direction in relation to where the sun is. If the sun is over head there's not much you can do, but early and late in the day try not to troll into the sun, more hits will occur going either perpendicular or away.

SilverBullets
02-21-2009, 10:29 PM
I thought of a couple more things that might help you out. Keep a good eye on your fishfinder. Last season the thermocline was different than years past where we fish, might have had to do with the late ice off. I noticed it was at different depths throughout the lake, and you had to keep adjusting for it.
A few years back I used to think that as long as your at the right depth, it didn't matter what you were useing when the bite was on. As long as you were in their face, your gonna get fish. We had experienced that before, but I found out one day lure color was much more important than I had previously thought. Dad and I had just got on the water, and we both had the same lures on, but different colors. I got a fish right after lowering down my set-up. Got it back down, and another fish on! Dad's looking at me like WTF? I told him to bring his in and I changed to exactly the same color I was useing, and after we got his down, all he** broke loose. It was complete chaos! We had a couple doubles... the poles were going down about every minute or two. Color does make a difference! I guess that day we had the right depth, speed, scent, and place....for once!

Kokaneemart
02-23-2009, 11:58 AM
All good input so far! :D

One other area I look at is leader length. Often I find that if I'm having an "off" day or the bite changes, I will lengthen my leader another 4-5 inches. It seems like a short leader is better on a hot bite and the fish key on the dodger and color combos and will strike. If they get lazy, I find a longer leader lenth will trigger a curious hit and that can work be the difference that day.

Also, the color of the dodger is very important. I find that the weather and cloud cover in high mountain lakes will change very often. If you are fishing with a silver dodger it is a mirror or what is around it. If it is clear and sunny in the morning the "mirror" reflect this light and shows a lot of flash and attraction. If the sky gets cloudy and the depth of the water is dark and green, then the mirror shows a dark surrounding and you will not have very much flash as you had when it was bright sunny. Try copper dodgers or even brass or gold and see if that helps the bite!

Fallriverguy
02-23-2009, 03:47 PM
I have often wondered if I should go louder to more diminutive when the bite slows. In green water I tend to go louder, but is clear blue lakes I tend to tone it down some. Smaller dodger, longer leader, longer set-backs from the ball and so forth. This year I plan to spend more time with the same lure and color if it was working before and switch dodger action.

A lot of what I do is predicated on my experiences from other fishing trips. I have a handful of go to lures for each lake and will try those first before digging deep into the tackle box.

SS7
02-23-2009, 09:43 PM
Those have been great tips.... Thanks to everyone for the time and effort ....


but can you explain one phenomenon I am experiencing??? I put a hootchie and few others behind a dodger and when I pulled them in to check on them after 20 mins of no action they were all wrapped up around the dodger?

so do many of you use the quick change stirrup/clevises for your spinner blade colors or just build ones up in copper and silver?

what about this last week at LBC when I marked fish at 40-80 ft but saw fish that almost jumped into my boat and all over the surface...

ok more to follow... love to give you guys questions

thanks for the help....

Fallriverguy
02-24-2009, 11:18 AM
but can you explain one phenomenon I am experiencing??? I put a hootchie and few others behind a dodger and when I pulled them in to check on them after 20 mins of no action they were all wrapped up around the dodger?



I think you are free spooling your gear out too fast. The dodger will sink faster than the hoochie. If the hoochie gets in front of the dodger it will wrap around.

The fish you see jumping are likely too shallow to mark with your FF. I don't know if they part of the school you mark deeper with a few individuals coming to the surface, or if they are a separate school.

SilverBullets
02-24-2009, 11:53 PM
I've had a few tangles over the years, but not that one. I think Fallriverguy brought up a good point. I think as long as your moving at trolling speed, and drop your setup slowly, you should be alright.
As far as those clevises go, I don't use the quick change one's. I just tie everything up with their own blades.
You will probably not see much on the fishfinder early in the season when their up high in the water column. Your cone angle on your transducer will not pick them up, in addition to the boat spooking them.